such_heights | Now the dust has settled a little

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Now the dust has settled a little

This week's SGA was big gay ridiculous plot space opera straight to the veins, oh my. \o/

Originally, this post was going to be the 15 Unpopular Opinions meme floating around Who fandom, but I wrote them and then realised they were all variations on the theme "I like this character/ship/episode that some people don't!". I think that is not exactly the point. Ah well, chipper to the bitter end, that is me. But let's make this a Doctor Who post regardless.

This post with its photo of Noel Clarke and Freema Agyeman from the TDK premier is amazingly cute. Cast friendships ftw! ♥

Now, it is poll time.

avendya did this at the end of Series 3 (you can view that poll here) and I thought I would resurrect it now, pitting the episodes from each series against each other. I've done a minor amount of tweaking, merging all the two-parters as one option save the finales and moving a couple of episodes so they're against other single episode stories. Some of these are really hard, some I'm pretty sure I can guess the outcomes of already. So, which episodes do you like best?

[Poll #1228453]

If you're gnashing your teeth at some of those, don't worry; so am I! And please, do share your thoughts on which you like best and why.

eta: Oops, nearly forgot. Now you've trawled your way through that, answer me this. Classic or New Who answers welcomed. What's your all-time favourite Doctor Who story? There'd be a poll for this too, but apparently LJ's fed up with me now.

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The Doctor/Jack/Martha threesome, with added Doctor/Master, at the end of S3. ;)

Hee, absolutely. So much fun!

I was going to do the poll, but um, I can't remember what some of the episodes actually were...*fail*. Although overall I think series 4 & 1 greatly > series 2 and 3. Just can't pick between 1 and 4...probably 4, but that might just be because I can remember it best.

All time favourite, I love Mawdryn(sp?) Undead with Five Tegan Turlough and Nyssa, and also Black Orchid. Oh but then, I really like Enlightenment too - can I just say that whole series?(I think they were in the same series...) I am so bad at (small, unimportant) decisions it's stupid *sigh*

Ah, I have such fondness for Series 1, it was all so shiny and new and a bit weird.

Ooh, Black Orchid's the only one I've seen out of those, so I'll make a note to check out the others! Yay Fivey. :D

How can you make me choose between the S1 and S4 Moff 2-parters? Brain. Might. Explode!

I am such a bad fangirl, because there are several eps from S1-3 that I actually haven't seen. What's up with that?

(icon! eeee, Jack & Rose, so very cute.)

I. Know. Sorry! All of the episodes in that particular face-offs are complete favourites of mine, gah.

Yes, what are you playing at? *g* Still, considering we don't get anything much new for an age I'd say you have plenty of time to catch up!

Ack! I had such a difficult time choosing between some of these, particularly Parting of Ways vs. Doomsday. Cried like a baby at both I tell you!

And I'm with

onehundredmoons on the Moff choosing, you wench!

And I'm clearly outvoted in my feeling that S3 was the weaknest, huh?

All the finales make me teary, every time. Eesh.

Haha, imagine I'd just made it a Moff question with GitF and Blink as well. THEN what would you have done?

And, well, yup! Why, out of interest? I've always had S3 right up there, That Dalek Episode we don't talk about aside.

It was nigh on impossible for me to decide properly between The Empty Child/The Doctor Dances, Human Nature/Family of Blood and Silence of the Library/Forest of the Dead triple whammy, so I went for the most recent episode ... because that's how my brain worked it out somehow qwlkjeqklwe;

I absolutely LOVE the build up at the end of Utopia, but that doesn't mean I wasn't "qçlklçewkrlçwke" throughout Turn Left, ahem. The Unicorn and The Wasp PWNS all, EVIDENTLY. As does Smith & Jones! It was the best series opener to date WHY YES.

Oh I forgot to comment on the finales. I do think The Sound of Drums worked better than The Stolen Earth, but I liked Journey's End more than Last of the Timelords (even though the latter had that very awesome musical number provided by the Master and the Scissors Sisters) for some reason. It was definitely sadder so maybe sad is indeed happy for deep people? Am I deep? LOL.

Edited 2008-07-23 20:08 (UTC)

so I went for the most recent episode ... because that's how my brain worked it out somehow

Right there with you. And I adore The Impossible Planet/The Satan Pit too, it's all terrible.

Yup, adore Turn Left madly, but omg Utopia is right up there as maybe my favourite episode ever? I don't know. But JACK and Derek Jacobi and the radiation room conversation and holy crap the last ten minutes. a;lsdja

You are so deep, bb, oh yeah. *g* See, I'm the other way round because even though The Sound of Drums is great, The Stolen Earth has so many glorious, glorious character moments such that it basically doesn't have a plot, and I like that in an opening part. By the final, on the other hand, I appreciate the greatly increased plottiness of LotTL.

I don't really like TIP/TSP all that much actually. To be honest, I haven't watched any s2 episode in a very long time. Same with s1, I barely remember what some of the episodes were like, except TEC/TDD that's probably engraved in my mind by now.

But JACK and Derek Jacobi and the radiation room conversation and holy crap the last ten minutes.

EXACTLY! The fobwatch, the Yana revelation, "I am...THE MASTER!" AHHH lkjkeqjlkejqwkle.

I agree that LotTL had a more consistent plot, but I can't help liking JE more, in a twisted way really, just because of the stronger emotions it sparked within me. SEE? I'M DEEP ROFL.

A rewatch is seriously is order, isn't it? I'm sure I haven't watched some of these in a couple of years, disgraceful behaviour.

So much keysmashing. And omg the music as well, Murray Gold at his finest.

JE is this incredible rollercoaster - from that awful montage of the companions as weapons and everyone the Doctor's lost to the DoctorDonna to everyone flying the TARDIS to the DOOM AND TRAGEDY, it's exhausting!

OH YES! However I'll probably embark on a journey ~~through time and space~~ through Old Who soon and watch some more episodes, yes, that's the plan and I'll stick to it. Mantra-style! Perhaps I'll start with Two again. I have a soft spot for Two, y'see. And Jamie. And Zoe. And the Brig. Hee.

JE was one of the most exhausting experiences I've ever had indeed. I was watching it with a friend and we just wouldn't stop uttering OMGs, WTFs and OHNOs throughout the whole thing. Trufax.

Funny you should mention that, actually! I've been meaning to ask someone - if I were to journey into the glories I hear about Two & Jamie & Zoe, any ideas on where I should start?

I started with The Mind Robber (plastic Medusas, unicorns and Two saving them writing fanfiction), then The Invasion (which has two reconstructed episodes but they're lovely, it's a UNIT story basically, with Cybermen and lime green feather boas!) then The War Games, all from his last series. Most of the episodes from series 4 and 5 have been burned so I recommend starting from series 6 really :(.

Edited 2008-07-24 20:46 (UTC)

That was really hard! Especially the What is and what should never be. question.

Gah, I know! Trying to decide by myself was so tricky I thought I should spread the pain.

I am much amused that considering I usually mainly hear criticism, season 3 is currently winning out - I wonder if that says something about your friends list.

I'm surprised that right now Dalek and Father's Day don't have any votes - as those were both close calls for me. A lot less surprised that VOTD don't - as that's the closest I've come to hating a Who episode.

Some of these were far too hard. I've been thinking for a while that I might do a massive new-who rewatch and rank them all as I go along. We'll see. I've definitely been mentally ranking the companions.

:D

It probably does - I seem to have quite a Martha-centric flist and lots of fans of Human Nature and Utopia and so on.

Yeah, I thought Dalek would be picking up a stronger second place, actually. Though I know Father's Day not a particularly stand-out episode for me at least, so considering what it's against that one doesn't surprise me as much.

A massive rewatch sounds like a great idea! I've had a similar thought for whenever the never-ending hiatus gets too much, probably sandwiching Torchwood in as well.

Hee yep - Father's Day had some massively tough competition - I just love it for the emotional stuff.

Rewatching for the win!

Also meant to say the first time that the picture of Martha and Micky was definitely squee inducing - particularly as during the season finale I couldn't help thinking they'd be a lovely couple, partly because I could ship Martha with almost anyone and partly because of the possible Torchwood casting rumours. :D

I'm now trying to remember when I last saw it, even. Not for a really long time! Rewatch rewatch rewatch, yes.

Psh, in my ~~probably batshit~~ head there's no doubt about it, after that bit in the finale! And yup, Martha/Mickey would be awesome, though I hope they stick with the admittedly enigmatic Tom on the show. Fandom, however, game on! (I've come to the conclusion I do actually ship everyone/everyone else. Heh.)

Hmmm... why is it that I'm suddenly getting the urge to start a Doctor Who rewatch community. One episode a week with a post going up for discussion each episode and a set time slot where people can meet up and chat as they watch...

Oh gods, why is there not more time in the day - I seriously need a Tardis.

And definitely agree with you on the shipping - I'm definitely not a OTP type of person - if you can make it interesting, I'm there.

Ooh, yes, that could be all kinds of fun! Although I suppose it is not exactly as though we're short on time to do something like that, so maybe when things calm down a little? But I would definitely be on board.

Well I may have have reserved a community name... or something.

I know my life's all over the place until the end of August, so I was thinking of a start sometime in September maybe.

It'll just be a matter of working out when's a good time for the group rewatch and advertising really.

That had to be the hardest poll ever!!! Utopia v. Turn Left nearly killed me as did The Empty Child / The Doctor Dances v. Human Nature / Family of Blood v. Silence in the Library / Forest of the Dead because I LOVE all of those!!!

So many good episodes. I feel like I need to make a compilation list of all my fav episodes from these past 4 seasons. oooooo list time!

Yeah, those absolutely slayed me as well. But in a fun way of reminding me how awesome they all are! And yup, list-making and rewatching is definitely the order of the coming months. W00t!

Okay so...definitely outnumbered...

So New Earth - mostly because of some reasonably good writing, and I like a little shop, but a very passionate kiss between NotRose and the Doctor, and it makes me laugh every time he raises his eyebrows like an idiot. Also it was our first -proper- introduction to Tennant as the Doctor, so he made me happy.

The second one was almost a draw between the last three, but I chose Tooth and Claw because I loved the proper werewolf in it. I don't get nice proper werewolves most of the time, and this one was beautifully designed for once.

Third - I totally went for School Reunion, although I loved a lot of Gridlock, especially Bliss. I loved Sarah Jane, and that scene where she finds the TARDIS in the cellar is just the most beautiful moment. Plus. I could watch ASH over and over again...

Four - Hah - I like the Sontaram Strategem too, but the Cybermen come in second. Couldn't stand Daleks in Manhatten, besides for that great moment where the TimeLordHumans all die, not including the Dalek!Pet, which just doesn't make sense to me. Not in that series, and not in any later ones either *koff* I liked the finale, if I didn't like some of the getting there.

Five - Five goes to Dalek, although I also like The Girl in the Fireplace equally. I love the clockwork monsters, and Arthur. But some of the revelations in Dalek blow that completely out of the water. A single Dalek on earth, in chains, and the Doctor - a murderer.

Six - 42! I loved 42. I definitely liked it more than The Unicorn and the Wasp, which most of everyone else seems to disagree with. I liked the running it to the time of the episode exactly, as well as the innocent sentient sun, and the brilliant -physics- in it. U+tW was good, but the end cheesed it off for me, because I'd read that book a couple of weeks before the episode, and I can tell you that it was nothing to do with giant wasps; the artist's impression, not Christie's.

Seven - I loved these episodes, but the Empty Child freaked me out, and of course, it introduced the wonderful Captain Jack. I did very much like Silence in the Library however. Spoilers! But also how intense it all got, although I couldn't stand the zombie spacesuit enemy...I much preferred the suspense to the physical enemy. I -loved- how clever it got in the end. Doctor Moon and Donna's weird family. Frightening in its own way.

Eight - Utopia. Just fwee. The Master. Turn Left was very good too, full of lovely fangasm, but nothing beats the Master.

Nine - The Sound of Drums hands down. But the others all have their say. I liked the Doctor/Master banter best, even though I loved the games on Bad Wolf it was...

Ten - The Parting of the Ways that was my favourite finale. I know it was very Deus Ex Machina, but it was also the -only- poignant kiss in the whole series; the others were very haphazardly doled out here there and everywhere, and this one was sweet, and romantic and 'It's killing me!' But I also loved the finale of Doomsday with Rose and the Doctor permanently seperated, even though she'd saved the world, and to a far lesser extent the ending of the Master's arc, although that DEM was a little less carefully doled out and the ending felt wrong. I mean...seriously - can't a bad guy just -escape- if you want to bring him back in another series? The Master was always escaping in the past, and whole armies of Daleks were not -all- wiped out. Some escaped. And if all these Daleks are escaping, then why haven't the Time Lords wriggled their way out of it yet?

Finally - went for Voyage of the Damned because I loved the ending, and people actually really died in it, instead of being vaporised. Plus I hated that big red spider; as far as enemies go, it was probably one of my least favourite ones, with the Absorbaloth being at the top of that particular list.

Series 4, however, is my favourite, because I loved Donna far more than I thought I would. I've been rewatching it all last week on BBC3, and I recalled that I actually enjoyed it, so there you go. But I hated the finale, and I know many, many people disagree with me. I just thought it was a series of cop outs and another Deus Ex Machina, this time for Donna. Timey wimey stuff is not something that should be used in place of actually bringing together a comprehensible ending to a brilliant cliffhanger. And an awful ending for Rose. Don't get me started. Its only redeeming feature was how terribly poignant the end of Donna's story was. It couldn't have been worse if she had died.

I very much liked the series of episodes starting with the death of Tom Baker's doctor and running over his regeneration - but, heh, that's a huge Master/Doctor arc, so surprise me. I'd have to say though, all things considered, I'd go for Blink in the blink of an eye. I mean, it doesn't involve any kind of Doctor Who as we know it; the Doctor's only in it for a few minutes, much like Love and Monsters, but for that, it's a brilliant episode that has you right on the edge of your seat all the way through. I also liked the conclusion of Midnight, which was 'People fear intelligence', and it was so incredibly subtle, and very unlike RTD for one of his scripts. Probably his best.

I agree with Sambethe that Series 3 was the weakest, but it appears to be everyone's favourite. It didn't seem to get off the ground really until about episode 5 or so, when the Doctor actually admitted that Martha was along for the ride, and until it did that it felt like all those episodes where the Daleks have come back despite being 'completely destroyed this time', and 'just one more trip'. I voted S4 despite my feelings on the finale, because I thought that Donna's transformation from a character I hated at conception to one I didn't want to part so permanently with, was quite stunning, and I enjoyed (almost) every moment of it. She was the one companion I enjoyed the banter with with the Doctor, and I think it was specifically because she didn't want a look at his Sonic Screwdriver. She also had her own catchphrases 'Oi spaceman' 'Don't you dare' etc, and didn't take any crap, or go along with stuff unless she knew what she was going along with, unlike say Martha Jones. Oh, this random stranger kissed me, well maybe he just likes me? Hang on, am I supposed to put up with any old random stranger kissing me? and Rose 'I know, let's just mosey on into the TARDIS and not ask what the hell's going on when we're all about to die.'

I ramble. Probably kill the word limit. Definitely probably annoy someone in regards to their favourite episode. Like I say, this is all just me. If we were all the same, it'd be a pretty dull world.

I love that practically every episode has someone rooting for it, it's great! Collectively, we love it all. :D I agree with so many of your points, which is why trying to choose between all of these is so hard in the first place. To pick up on a couple:

I loved Sarah Jane, and that scene where she finds the TARDIS in the cellar is just the most beautiful moment.

Oh gosh yes, and then the Doctor just appearing out of the dark, that's fantastic.

It didn't seem to get off the ground really until about episode 5 or so, when the Doctor actually admitted that Martha was along for the ride

*nods* This is my one big thing with S3 - in my opinion, if they'd effectively had the conversation at the end of The Lazarus Experiment moved to the end of Gridlock we would have had a lot more time to get used to Martha and the Doctor as a real team before all the big plot stuff started kicking off. Aside from that, though, still my favourite just for the strength of most of the stories and Martha's fabulousness.

Ooooh, difficult poll! It's interesting to have to choose, especially when particularly good or favorite episodes are up against each other.

I'm surprised at how well season three is doing! There are some episodes I love from that season (The Shakespeare Code and Human Nature/Family of Blood, as well as Blink) among them. But I've been contemplating lately how very well season/series one was planned out. Maybe it's because it was the first Davies arc I experienced, but I think it was really well constructed. And I think The Parting of the Ways is hands down the best finale, especially considering how seasons three and four ended. (Clearly I liked neither Last of the Time Lords or Journey's End. Heh.) Doomsday is good as well, but PotW was just . . . wow.

I'm the only one who chose Father's Day, which was hard, especially due to Blink being in the same poll. And that was mostly due to personal reasons. When I first saw Who, up to that point I thought, okay, this is a cool show and I like it. But after Father's Day -- well, that was when Who owned me. :) FD was a punch to the gut for me; completely cemented my love for Rose and for the Doctor.

It's a fun way to look at them, I think. Fun, yet possibly evil, haha.

I'm surprised people are surprised! I think I'm used to the fact that largely my flist really liked S3, even if that's not the overall fandom consensus. Personally I think it's well structured in terms of themes, at least, as it's all about what it means to be human which is then explored in different ways. But certainly in terms of leading up to a finale, there's nothing that really beats the Bad Wolf motif, which still gives me shivers when I'm rewatching.

I really haven't watched that episode in absolutely ages, I need to get on that! I think we all have special fondnesses for the episodes that we just loved at the time, which is part of the fun of it.

That was *hard*! I found the 'Into Time' question most difficult, but the Shakespeare theatre geek in me won out in the end.

Hee, glad to hear it. I agree, though, those are all excellent stories!

I suppose, by right of having watched it so many times when I force my friends into Doctor Who, I'm just more fond of S1. I mean, Nine. :D S4 is very much a close second, though to coin a phrase from my friend Darienne, "the difference in how much I love them goes out to, like, the tenth decimal place." (I'm not madly in love with S3 in retrospect, I seem to realize, though Utopia and TSoD were all manner of *FLAILS UNCONTROLLABLY*.)

All-time favorite...The Empty Child/The Doctor Dances. Because...come ON. JACK. UST. DANCING. CREEPY CHILD. THE MOFF. What else does an episode NEED?

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Now the dust has settled a little

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